Strange New Worlds

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Solitaire
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Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Fri Jun 10, 2022 10:04 pm

Pulling some relevant stuff from the general good tv thread, so we can discuss in depth without hijacking :)
Raid wrote:
Thu May 12, 2022 7:16 pm
Strange New Worlds

It seems there's at least one person at Paramount that has seen a Star Trek episode from the 90s, as the first one of SNW does feel a lot like it. It's paced more like the shows when they weren't trying to spend massive effects budgets (not that it looks cheap), and the characters have actual conversations instead of exasperatingly crying. The cast are great; Mount's Captain Pike is every bit as charismatic and thoughtful as any of the other franchise captains, and I think the rest of the bridge crew we've not had a proper introduction for yet still had more lines (and indeed names) than most of Discovery's cast got in the first season. I'm still not totally convinced by Peck's Spock though; he has at least lost the beard he had in Discovery, but he doesn't feel like he's trying to imitate Nimoy's Spock, and I'm not sure whether that's good or bad considering they're meant to be the same character.

The story is pretty good. It does get a little heavy-handed with the social commentary, but at least it has social commentary, much like Star Trek of old. It certainly feels more similar to TOS than TNG in that regard, which is appropriate given the era it's set in.

It's early days yet, and the trailer that played at the end of the episode did look eerily like one from Discovery, but then trailers usually do feature a lot of action scenes so it'd be unfair to judge it based on that, but if the rest of the series carries on like the first episode, it could well be the return of the franchise I grew up on. There's a couple of references to things that were name checked in Picard S2 also, so I suspect they're going to work that in as an arc of sorts, but we'll see.
Raid wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 6:24 pm
....and the second episode is just as good, if not better. There's obvious chemistry between the crew, there's just the right amount of cheesiness to it, and while there's a little silliness in proceedings, the solution they eventually come up with is based on at least a basic scientific principle rather than just pretending via treknobabble. And it's optimistic, one of the things that Picard and Discovery sorely lacked (or at least, when Discovery tried it, it was dialled up to 11 and utterly cringeworthy).

I'm really enjoying this, I hope they keep it up.
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Fri Jun 10, 2022 10:05 pm

Solitaire wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 12:41 am
Strange New Worlds, Supplemental: Episodes 3 & 4

I found E3 to be the weakest so far, with a well-worn premise seen not only in lots of other sci-fi shows but Star Trek episodes of yesteryear. Just felt rushed and phoned-in by the cast. And apparently, No. 1 has plot-armor type powers? I'll say this, though - Dr. M'Benga's dialog near the end was heartfelt, and
Spoiler
when he looks away from the camera to say, breathlessly, "to say goodbye," it was a little punch to the gut. Well done by Mr. Olusanmokun.

E4 has made up for E3, however - strong story, definitively old-school ST vibes, and some surprisingly emotive acting in some scenes, especially
Spoiler
the mind-meld sequence, which was handled quite well by the actor playing Spock - presented as stoically Vulcan, but with an undercurrent of emotion in his voice that raised the hairs on the back of my neck. It wasn't just the particular situation they were in, but also a sense of tension or unease, even menace, because here they are inside each other's minds, where anything can happen just like in a dream, or a nightmare.
Interesting to me that the security officer reminds me so much of Drummer from The Expanse, not sure if that's purposeful or just my impression. The tight black eyeliner and intensity is giving me Drummer vibes, let's say that, and not a bad thing at all. Interesting character and glad to get a little more background on her. Mount's Captain Pike continues in strong fashion. He delivers his lines with space and thoughtfulness, giving depth to the conversations, compared to what some actors will do, which is rushing and hammering their lines at the audience. Good stuff, here's hoping that following episodes stay on course.
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Fri Jun 10, 2022 10:06 pm

Solitaire wrote:
Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:51 pm
Raid wrote:
Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:20 pm

Strange New Worlds is still better (than Orville). They actually did a light-hearted episode last week, which was brave for a show that was only 4 episodes old - usually comedy Star Trek episodes (think DS9's baseball episode) rely on well established character traits, but they pulled it off. It's honestly surprising, as one of the two story arcs relies on a well-trodden trope that you wouldn't think Star Trek would ever attempt (my initial reaction was "wait, are they really doing this?!"), but it shows just how good the previous four hours were that I could accept and really enjoy it.

SNW episode 5 was quite decent! I enjoyed it despite still not liking the pilot character ;) There was some clever comedy happening with the story arc you've mentioned - I'm thinking specifically, again, of Capt. Pike's interactions, that actor is such a good fit for this series. He's really good at the "inspiring speech from the wise captain" paragraphs that he's had to recite every episode so far. The other story arc was a bit silly, but fun, and the final scene was pretty spectacular, I have to say.
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Fri Jun 10, 2022 10:13 pm

Episode 6 was pretty damned impressive! Lots of moral ambiguity, a tense, dark storyline, a tiny bit of hope for a certain character on the ship... The twist of the main storyline was slowly hinted at, well enough that it wasn't screamingly obvious:
Spoiler
…and they let it happen! Captain Pike didn't "save the day," neither did anyone else. I started feeling the mood of the show change at the same time that I started understanding what was coming. Well done! Also, Kirk's brother makes another short appearance, which has me smiling because the actor looks almost exactly like a friend of mine back in Mountain View, CA, 'stache and goofy attitude included :)
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Raid » Sat Jun 11, 2022 12:33 pm

It really did feel like an episode of TOS; they've done such a good job of updating the style and themes of the sixties show for modern audiences.

..but not all of TOS was particularly good, and sadly I didn't think as much of this one. It's still really well made, but I found the payoff unsatisfying.
Spoiler
The entire concept of the episode is that a child has to suffer and die to maintain this idyllic civilisation. That's not elaborated on in a way that's satisfying for me, they just hook the kid up and that's it, which makes the twist feel like a bit of a let down. The episode frequently makes it seem like this civilisation is pretty advanced, and it seems a bit odd that they don't understand how the machine that literally keeps that civilisation alive isn't understood by them, particularly when there's no suggestion of it being an alien invention. I'm not sure if it's intentional; is the questionable morality of the machine supposed to suggest that they haven't actually tried to replace it, and just continue sacrificing children because it's convenient?

Something just felt a little off about the script the whole way through. Pike is constantly wanting to break Starfleet's non-intervention policy, to the point where characters from the civilisation in question have to remind him of it three or four times. They accidentally shoot down the hostile ship at the start, and then just let it crash without taking any action to prevent it or save the occupants. Pike casually talks about his upcoming doom to someone he barely knows, when he's kept that a closely guarded secret previously.

It's still better than anything PIC did, the writing would have to really plummet off a cliff to come down to that level, but it wasn't the show's strongest episode. It's still thought-provoking, it's got me thinking of moral questions after I've finished watching, when most of PIC had me wanting to just forget it existed.

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:07 pm

I suppose that's why I like the episode so much, because of all the unanswered questions and ambiguity. It's refreshing in an era of tv that hyper-explains every last crumb of a plot or story, spoon-feeding a slack-jawed audience all the answers. I think this episode is a setup to another, down the line. Your second paragraph brings up a good point, for sure, re: the "Oh no! Anyway..." reaction
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Raid » Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:15 pm

You're right, I suppose. The episode probably is more effective because it engages your brain a bit, but it just felt a little bit... vacant, like it was a good starting point to a story (although seemingly it's based on a literary work from the 70s), it just could have done with a bit more filling out.

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Sly Boots » Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:19 pm

Sounds like they took the plot for that from an Ursula Le Guin short story...

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Raid » Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:21 pm

Everyone seems to have heard of this book but me.

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Sly Boots » Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:22 pm

Raid wrote:
Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:21 pm
Everyone seems to have heard of this book but me.
We actually did a lecture on it at uni, it's this one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ones_ ... rom_Omelas

Edit: reading that it says ST Discovery S3 (I've not seen it) stole it's entire season storyline from it :lol:

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Raid » Sat Jun 11, 2022 4:23 pm

Oh I know what it is now, I was just deliberately not posting the title in case it could be considered a spoiler. :lol:

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Sat Jun 11, 2022 10:40 pm

Well now that's a straight-up rip-off of a main plot. I'd have been much less impressed, at first watching, if I'd have known of that novel. Interesting too, that's at least a second mention of Le Guin on our little forums, due to my four-decade search for that movie based upon another of her novels.

I agree, Chris, that episode 6 could have easily been made a two-parter, and given us a lot more story. Agreed, too, that Pike suddenly forgets his commission as soon as he sees his old flame :)
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Sat Jun 18, 2022 3:51 am

Episode 7: this damned show, I swear. There's a plot twist as subtle as a slap on the face, and the bad guy has been directed to deliver all lines with overladen sarcasm and smarmy nonsense to the point that I stopped watching 2/3rds of the way through. I'll finish it later, but for now I have to say that this episode has taken the show down so many notches, Christ Almighty I hope this horrid writing and directing is a one-off. There's way more awful crap, I just couldn't bring myself to even try to recall any of it. Ugh.
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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Raid » Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:07 pm

I'm willing to accept the odd duff episode when the quality has been significantly higher on average, and to be honest I still enjoyed the silliness. It felt a little out of place for a Star Trek show, but the light-hearted way the crew have interacted so far didn't make it feel out of place for Strange New Worlds. The main cast very much carried this one.

Not really sure where they're going with the reveal at the end though.

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Re: Strange New Worlds

Post by Solitaire » Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:09 pm

Episode 8 - wow, what a thoroughly, 100% solid gold pile of shit. I give up. I know I started this doomed thread, but unless the writers of the last two episodes die in a giant meteor attack, I'm just not saying another goddam word.
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